Music in Marion

Published on November 16, 2018

https://www.samford.edu/departments/oral-history/projects/samwav/Music-in-Marion.mp3

"I just think it happens because music breaks the human down to the simplest form. Music doesn’t have a color, it doesn’t have an identity . . . you know, it doesn’t have a race, it doesn’t have a gender. It’s for everybody."

Chapters

Introduction: Perceptions of Perry County

Claire Davis and Michelle Little introduce Samuel Robertson’s podcast on music in Perry County; Dr. Beth McGinnis discusses outsiders’ perceptions of Perry County.

Play Segment

Challenges at Francis Marion School

Dr. Cathy Trimble, the principal of Francis Marion School, explains the difficulties in the school and its area and discusses some of her strategies to change the school’s culture.

Play Segment

The Robert C. Hatch School Band

Isaac Lanier, director of the Robert C. Hatch School band, discusses his experiences with music in the Black Belt, as well as the challenges he has faced there and his plans for his band.

Play Segment

Transcript

[HARWELL GOODWIN DAVIS: He stated that he had been appointed to suggest a
president for Howard College.

EUNICE ROGERS: And so there was a lot of industry in Bessemer when I grew up, a
lot of progressiveness. However, it was still a typical, small, Southern town.

OLIVER BARREAU: To be perfectly honest with you, um, I didn't know what Alabama
was until I set foot in Alabama.

ELIZABETH SLOAN RAGLAND: I was not greeted by hecklers. I was greeted by Martha
Ann Cox.]

MICHELLE LITTLE: Welcome back to Sam.wav. We are your hosts, Michelle Little--

CLAIRE DAVIS: --and Claire Davis.

MICHELLE LITTLE: And today we're bringing you a story on music education in
the Black Belt of Alabama.

CLAIRE DAVIS: Last spring. Dr. Beth McGinnis decided to take her Senior Seminar
course in a different direction. Her class packed up instruments and recorders
and drove down to Marion and Union Town. This area is a time capsule of the
agrarian South that continues today. In 1934, Renwick Kennedy wrote that the
Black Belt "stands for an economy, a culture, and a philosophy of life. To
an Alabamian, Black Belt means a traditional way of life first and a strip of
territory second."€ Eighty years later, Marion is still firmly steeped in
tradition from the past. The class played alongside the students and heard
plenty of stories from the faculty at the two county high schools, Francis
Marion and Robert C. Hatch. In their interviews with Principal Cathy Trimble and
band director Isaac Lanier, the class learned the role of music in education in
Perry County.

MICHELE LITTLE: When the semester ended, though, Dr. McGinnis wasn't
content to call it quits. Recruiting one of the students in the class, senior
Samuel Robertson, she approached us to discuss the best way to spread the
stories they heard, and, naturally, we jumped at the idea of a podcast about an
aural education. So, without further ado, we'll let Samuel's work
speak for itself and let you listen to "the Music in Marion."

SAMUEL ROBERTSON: Hi, I'm Samuel Robertson, a senior at Samford University,
and this podcast is about rural Alabama and the impact of music on its
communities. And we're specifically talking about Perry County, Alabama,
which is home to the two small towns of Marion and Union Town. And even if you
live in Alabama, this is an area that you may not have heard of because of its
small size and its relatively out-of-the-way location. Dr. Beth McGinnis,
assistant professor of musicology at Samford University, tells us about her
experience in Perry County.

BETH MCGINNIS: One of the things that, um, that I've noticed is that when
an outside group comes into Perry County, we, we notice what they don't
have. We notice lack. It's an economically depressed area. And we see that,
you know, we come in from Birmingham, which, at least in the over the mountain
communities, um, it's a very different culture, and we see those
differences, we see what they don't have, but at the same time, working
with the, um, community kids, in Seed Camp, I've noticed all along that
there's also a richness of culture, and, um, a richness of character, and,
and just, and ability and enthusiasm and there's this beautiful community
spirit, and, um, it just seemed to me to be, um, to be important to look,
emphasize that, to emphasize the assets in that community.

SAMUEL ROBERTSON: So there are only two public schools in Perry County.
There's Robert C. Hatch High School in Union Town, and there's Francis
Marion School, which is a K through 12 school in Marion. And Dr. McGinnis and
students from her senior seminar class for music majors have interacted with
these schools, specifically their music programs. And they've conducted
some interviews while they were with them. The first interview is with Francis
Marion's principal, Dr. Cathy Trimble, and she first talked about growing
up in Marion and returning there to teach and how things have changed.

CATHY TRIMBLE: It has changed tremendously, um, probably at the time when, when
I was here, um, there was a lot of diversity among the staff and the student
body as well. I went off to college and when I came back-- I didn't try
to come back, I got married in college, and my husband got the job, and he was a
football player, and his coach got the principal's job, and he was like,
and you know, "you're, you're a really nice guy, you're a
religious guy, I really want somebody to come back and run my office at the
school I'm principal at." He was like "okay, where is it?"
My husband was looking for a job. He said "Probably in a place that
you've never heard of. This little small town called Marion, Francis
Marion." So he came home that night and told me in our apartment, I was
tearing the place apart, "you serious? We're gonna--"€ (laughter)
So that's how I got back here. And, um, at the time, things were still a
lot like it was, very, very, very diverse, but then in 1987 they found that the
court order-- Actually, it wasn't a court order, to split the school
systems from Perry county to Marion city, so-- Marion city schools had to
dissolve. And it all became Perry County. Well, at that time when I'd been
asked, they kept the same, um, administrators, everything from- I take that
back, the central office, the superintendent and everything, from the county
school. Since Marion City was formed illegally, if you could say. And at that
time we had white flight, and the private school started, and so we lost, um,
practically all of our, I guess, we're not so diverse now, okay, I guess is
a nice way to put it. Okay, so it has changed tremendously, um, but as an
administrator, um, I wanted to come in, and of course when you have a, a drastic
change like that, a lot of things change, the culture change, the perception of
the school change, a whole lot of things change.

SAMUEL ROBERTSON: We asked Dr. Trimble about some of the challenges she has
faced as a school administrator.

CATHY TRIMBLE: Like I said, a few years ago, we were, our, our school, we were
going through a lot of transitions. A lot of transitions that has really, really
hurt our school. And one of the main things is there is no industry here in our,
in our town, there's, so what our parents do, is a lot of our parents
either work like at Mercedes, those, those subsidiaries of Mercedes or maybe in
Montgomery with, uh, Hyundai or something like that. And, initially, um, they
would allow their students to stay, and they would commute. And then the year,
the one the gas prices went crazy, that's the year when it really started,
it started where we lost a lot of students. Then our academics went, I mean, we
nosedived from where we were to like rock bottom, and so, on that famous failing
school list, so then we lost a lot of students then. Which, we're no longer
there now, I might add. (laughter) So, and we're looking, and we're
bouncing back. And I, I just say this, um, we're making a rebound, but
that's just a part of that culture of changing that we're talking
about. So, a lack of industry, a lot of parents move away because of their jobs,
so weâ€™ve lost a lot of students, weâ€™ve lost a lot of students. Our
rate of enrollment has declined tremendously, which is why weâ€™re a pre-K-12 school.

SAMUEL ROBERTSON: One obstacle the schools face is the many families who leave
Marion in search of better employment.

CATHY TRIMBLE: And then when we do, as our superintendent, which is, I totally
agree. We have the, our students, the number of students going to college, I
think within the last two years I think at least 79% of our students go to
college. We, we really emphasize that. Our graduation rate is over 90% and then
not just going, unless they can't afford it, they're staying and
they're graduating. But then we have those who just cannot afford it and
then, once again, you know, we've lost those students, so what can, how can
we help them. But, um, but the ones that do stay and graduate, which is quite a
few, they never come back. So, you know, it's like, (unclear), sort of
shoot yourself in the foot when you do a pretty good job of educating them, but
then when they get educated they go to the big cities, and who wants to come,
they always say, "well, there's a McDonalds and a Walmart here, so who
wants to come--" So, it was, we have a problem also, with retention of
teachers. We can get some good teachers but, I mean, they can't-- And
then the women always tell me, "if you find me a husband I'll
stay" and bye, baby, can't do that. (laughter) I'm sorry,
I'll try, but, I mean, you know, so, it's those types of things like
that. So we've had some awesome teachers that come through, you know, but
it's just always hard to keep them here and married when there's
nothing to do.

SAMUEL ROBERTSON: Dr. Trimble and her husband have both worked in Perry County
schools, and they had the resources to supplement their own children's
education with out-of-town activities, but she realizes that other families
don't have the same opportunity.

CATHY TRIMBLE: I will say this, it was hard for our children, being that, my
husband and I are both teachers at school. (laughter) They had a hard time,
baby, they had a hard time. (laughter) But for me, I guess the thing, it was
kind of hard for me too, because those things that we wanted our children to be
involved in, like I had, like how my parents did, they're not here. So, you
know, we'd have to take our children somewhere else to do dance and
somewhere else to do music, you know, all of our children did do music, I
traveled on Saturdays, at least an hour away for my children to take piano
lessons, those types of things. But it was hard because those things are not
here. So that's another reason why our children are not involved. Yes, I
could afford to do that, you know, to do that for my children, but how many
parents can actually do that, can actually take their children to where they
need to go, to get that exposure to those things and now we have, now we have a
bonus child that's ten, um, and now we have her and I'm doing the same
thing. So I travel to (unclear) and I take her to piano, travel, like, to
Tuscaloosa to take dance. You know, and so, it's hard. Like I said,
we'll do that, but, you know, there's just not a whole lot of parents
able to do that. So do I think they want to? Absolutely. Absolutely. And there
are some that still do, um, but it's just hard for the...

SAMUEL ROBERTSON: Dr. Trimble told us about the grand dreams she has to widen
her students' horizons by bringing the outside world in.

CATHY TRIMBLE: Um, and, and one thing that I wanted to do was to change the
culture of our school and I wanted our students to experience what I experienced
as a child. Although the diversity is not here and the population, there's
a lot that you can be exposed to, there's a lot that you can learn outside
of what you go home and see every single day, so we've really been working
on that. And, um, the students have been responding extremely well. I do
appreciate that much. That's why, like it's so important to me that
our students are exposed to more than just what they see or what their peers
listen to or hear, you know, that type of thing. Um, we do, we do a, we do
advisory here, where each teacher has to do some, so we, so our students know,
and this is what you begin them in, okay, so when advisory starts instead of
getting them in, come in saying, "it's advisory time," we play a
song. Okay, so we play this song, they know, "oh," I don't have
to say anything, they're conditioned, they know it's time to go to
advisory. So, you know, I can put a different kind of music, uh, normally, uh,
I'll give you another way we, again, the, if you notice the, the T.V.
monitor? Okay, I'm using the pipe, I'm using it through that, and
there's my music going all day. Okay, maybe jazz, there may be gospel,
there may be Christmas, or- Christmas, you know, and, you know, next day
they'll come up like "you know, doctor, why're you playing
that?" You know, I like it, and then you'll hear them going down the
hall singing it, think "ha ha, gotcha!"€ (laughter) (claps) So yeah,
but this morning, this week for some reason we've been having problems with
the internet and our, our tech person came home to try to get it right and then,
and then they'll say, you know, "we need the music going, I don't
hear it" so, you know, so that's another way that we try to do it too.
You know, if they can't go out to be exposed, I try to bring the exposure
to them. So, um, but it is still in the black belt area, religious and, um,
church and that type of thing is, is a big part of our children's culture,
um, so like I said, you know, even when I play the music there, Iâ€™ll play,
you know, gospel music, you know, I'll be playing my gospel, the gospel
music, and the students will come up, and they're singing those songs and
(unclear). And then not only that, um, my husband pastors a church in Union Town
that's like, 20 minutes away. Because of that, our children, um, on
Wednesday night we go to service, we have like, they be packed all on top of
each other, they want to go to church. They want to go, so we do carry them to
church. That is a big part of the children's, they'll come up, we have
um, they'll come up and ask us, "can you come and pray with me?"
you know, "I'm having this problem"€ so, you know, that's a
big part of it, that is a really big part of it. Uh, yeah. It really is. And
it's, it's a big part of our culture.

SAMUEL ROBERTSON: Dr. Trimble is committed to the education of her students
beyond the curriculum and the classroom. Dr. Trimble is firm on discipline while
still letting the students know that they're loved by listening to problems
and caring about their stories. And Dr. Trimble has set up partnerships with
colleges throughout Alabama that frequently send college students to interact
with the students of Francis Marion School. Dr. Trimble intends to add to the
students' stories by exposing them to diversity, done through music and
extracurricular activities, and though interaction with colleges all around
Alabama. Further south, in Union Town, Alabama, we interviewed the Robert C.
Hatch School band director, Isaac Lanier, while hosting his band at Samford
University, where we ate together, played some games together, and performed for
each other.

[musical interlude]

SAMUEL ROBERTSON: Mr. Isaac Lanier told us about his own background as a band
musician and his drive for excellence in his band program.

ISAAC LANIER: So, I play for many ensembles at my high school, Alabama State
University, Talladega College, uh, Memphis Mass Band, Memphis Alumni Band,
Mississippi Alumni All-Star Band, and, uh, L.L.I., Louisiana, Louisiana
Leadership Institute. Uh, a bunch of different ensembles, uh, just to take and
kind of cultivate myself with different areas, to adapt myself to be able to do
different styles of play, not only being to compete with myself with Alabama
baritone players, but I could go sit in any band room and do just as well as
anybody, that was my ultimate goal. You know, not to ultimately be the best, but
be one of the greats, one of the legends and be remembered. So, now I've
reached status I'm going to pass along to the kids, and, you know, make a
couple more "me"€s, and hopefully to be better than me.

SAMUEL ROBERTSON: Union Town faces many of the same challenges that Marion does
and suffers from a lack of resources. Mr. Lanier has responded by furnishing
several of the band's instruments himself.

ISAAC LANIER: Union Town has a sense of pride like no other, um... Man, when
I say pride, like, the city bands together for, the, the, when it comes to the
sports, as long as you're doing something, one thing now-- So let's
just scratch everything. Let's say this. This is my first year working in
Union Town and what I'm almost double-sure is, if you're in the
community and you're doing something positive for their children, doing
something right, keeping them out of trouble, being a great example, people will
rally together, do whatever they need to do to make it happen for those kids.
That's what I love about Union Town. Some of the challenges I face, is, uh,
some of the challenges pretty much I face at other schools. Uh, the
culture's trying to die out, so you have to, you know, keep them,
influencing them, tell them why it's important, show them why it's
important, and, uh, I think essentially at this school, I've never had a
school that didn't have any instruments. So that was kind of heartbreaking.
Left me broke for a little while, but now you see why I worked so hard, uh, not
going to let that money go to waste.

SAMUEL ROBERTSON: Music is a powerful tool, and Mr. Lanier talks about what
music does for those who are listening to it.

ISAAC LANIER: I just think it happens because music breaks the human down to the
simplest form. I mean, music doesn't have a color, it doesn't have an
identity, you know, it doesn't have a race, it doesn't have a gender.
It's for everybody. And once they start playing, it's going make you
feel a couple of ways, happy, sad, excited, you know, but either way, music is
one of the only things in the world that can completely hack into a human and
control everything without even trying to. And so, with that being said, um, I
just try to push the music, you know, so, so much, because a lot of people
don't even know how much regular life and everyday things relates to band
you know, analogies, like, we talk about tempo, tempo is in everything, you can
go fast in a car, you can go fast walking on your feet, you know. Dynamic
contrast, you know, you can talk loud and it would affect the way a conversation
dictates with somebody, (speaks more quietly) but you approach them like this,
you know, different things, and I use all kind of life situations in the
classroom like that to try to make great analogies to help them understand the
way music makes me feel, why I'm so excited about it, you know, any time
anything happens, let's, let's cut on some music, let's,
let's, you know, let's do something musical. And one, I feel like once
you know they get that feeling, then they'll eternally, not essentially,
eternally be on the right path.

SAMUEL ROBERTSON: Like Dr. Trimble, Mr. Lanier wants to open for his students
the world he experienced growing up.

ISAAC LANIER: I don't like to mention this story too much, but this is what
kind of kickstarted me to really being serious about band, because me being from
New York, I mean, we have orchestras and symphonic bands and wind ensembles but
the way we do marching band in the south is not a comparison at all, you know
the north might not even have it. And so, you know, uh it was a joke when we
first got here, you know, this kid from New York, you know, thought I was a
little bit better than everybody, you know, knew more. Go to a football game,
and I'm like, "wow,"€ you know, "it's half time,
let's go to the concession stand"€ and they're like "nah, nah
nah nah, the band's about to start,"€ I'm like "so?"
They like "dude, do you know where you at? Do- do- Just sit right here,
you'll see why nobody's moving."€ And that was my first time
seeing a half time show. By Selma High School. It was in about 2004. I was in
middle school and I'll never forget it. My cousin, she was a dancer, and
she danced at Clark Atlanta University, in Atlanta, Georgia. She graduated, but
we all went to support her and the crowd went crazy. It was a euphoric feeling,
you know, and I'd never experienced anything like that because the football
games I'd went to, if the crowd weren't cheering, I mean you could
throw a couple of tumble weeds out there and that would get it going more than
anything that you would hear. So to see the crowd roaring the way they did for
this band, you know, I could, I never understood it, you know I'm just like
"it's just band stuff you know?"

SAMUEL ROBERTSON: Mr. Lanier sees band discipline as a means of preparing his
students to succeed in life.

ISAAC LANIER: If you can matriculate through my band program--and I have very
strict rules--if you can matriculate through my program, you'll be an
excellent adult. Because a) you'll know how to talk to people--you know,
there's a certain time and a certain place to do and say certain things.
There are certain things that won't be allowed, it's not acceptable,
and you're going to have to have discipline 'cause if you have chaos
it's [sound of slapping noise] it's just going to be a lot of
friction. So I am, I am in agreeance with him. I'm going to have a couple
who are going to go out and be band directors, but just like I tell them, my
students, regular students, band students, all, through it all, I'm just
teaching you how to think not what to think. How to think. How to be able to
matriculate through life. You know, how to be able to fend and not depend on
anybody. You'll be able to fend for yourself. I just want you to be a great
person. So you can be able to appreciate stuff and know what it takes to earn
and work hard and deserve something, and enjoy yourself in life.

SAMUEL ROBERTSON: Several years ago, Isaac Lanier formed the Black Belt United
Mass Band and has seen the power music has to unite the community.

ISAAC LANIER: In 2011 I took a semester off of school in Selma, Alabama. In
central Alabama area, people will refer to it as the Black Belt of Alabama
because of how we (unclear) just kind of go straight across the waistline of
Alabama. And so to say, I don't want to say I got bored, but it was kind of
that and I was working on a unity thing. So I just kind of sat down with some
friends one day and I said, "Man, what if we got a lot of people from Selma
High School and Southside," because it's not unified, you know.
It's a lot of violence and stuff going on. So I said, "What if I could
find a way to sort of fuse these together, because it's never been done
before." And I'd have to take somebody who is well known on both ends.
And everybody from my band knew me and I had a lot of relatives in the rival
band. My first cousin actually played the same instrument as I played so we just
kind of hung out for a summer and we brainstormed on it. I so I was really, I
can't say really that it was on me. We all kind of came on with the idea,
but the school you know and I ran with it and I said, "Mr. Williams, man,
look, I have an idea.' So I mean, it was just a blessing you know. Me just
being a kid and thinking "what if we put these bands together you know to
stop some beef." You know, some of the violence. Maybe if they see okay we
all in it for the same reason, we just looking at it differently, then maybe
it'll solve some of the problems. Because communication is the main part of
it all. So, it just happened and there was born Black Belt United Mass Band. And
this year, we're hoping to do it again, now that several years have passed.
I've graduated, I've had friends who graduated, a couple people that
come from Selma High as well as me have graduated, and we all have marching
bands that have been working strongly all year round, so, hopefully we'll
pull it all together and hoping to have almost 200 people together from four
schools. Four or five schools. So, starting small but, faith as a mustard seed
will get you going.

SAMUEL ROBERTSON: We asked Mr. Lanier about plans he has for his band.

ISAAC LANIER: Within another year or two, as long as God keep blessing and we
keep working hard, I'll get my band instruments. I've gotten band
stands from donorschoose.org. My next step hopefully is to get band room style
chairs, you know, to help with posture, plant posture. You know, there's a
bunch of small things like that. Technical things to paint the bigger picture. I
want to get band room chairs, I would like to really-- I would love to get
uniforms for my school. That's one thing that I'm really, really
working towards. Because certain events we go to, I don't mention it too
much, but at the same time I do observe everything and sometimes a wind suit is
not proper attire for a performance but at the same time, if that's all you
have that's the only thing you can do. I notice sometime how the kids react
when they see a band stepping out with clean spats and shakehoes and capes
swinging when they do the horn swinging. We're going to have uniforms in
about, about two years. I want to say two minimum.

SAMUEL ROBERTSON: Mr. Lanier was able to get band uniforms in two months rather
than two years. Miles College has the same school colors, purple and gold, and
they donated a beautiful set of uniforms to Robert C. Hatch School. Now Mr.
Lanier is working on buying shiny new brass instruments for the band. Mr. Lanier
is determined to use music and his position as band director to educate the
community in the joys of making music and also to progress the band program at
Robert C. Hatch School, but ultimately to unify the community, to mediate
divisions already made, and to dissolve violence between individuals and groups,
all through the common love for music. Music has a voice in Perry County. A
voice that exposes students to different cultures. A voice that motivates
students to work hard and find success, and a voice that reaches beyond hatred
to bring people together. It has a voice of its own, a voice that has a loud
authority to tell anyone that hears it what the people of Perry County, Alabama are all about.

[musical interlude]

CLAIRE DAVIS: Our theme was written and produced by Samford student Kerry Joiner.

The background music was produced by Kerry Joiner and the musical performance was
the Robert C. Hatch School band.

The interviews with Cathy Trimble and Isaac Lanier were conducted by Dr. Beth
McGinnis's senior seminar class.

This episode was written and produced by Michelle Little and Claire Davis.

This is a Samford Traditions and Oral History Recordings Initiative Production.
For more information on our program, you can find our page on the Samford
website or follow us on social media at Facebook and Instagram at Samford_STORI
and on Twitter at SU_STORI.

Audio Information
Attribute	Value
Repository	Samford University Oral History Collection
Accession	SUHist/STORI/011